Soul Asylum share the inspiration behind new album, 'Slowly But Shirley'
November 05, 2024
Our November Artists of the Month, rock icons Soul Asylum, stopped by The Current studio to perform songs from their 13th studio record, Slowly but Shirley. Vocalist David Pirner and guitarist Ryan Smith also talked with Diane, host of The Local Show, about the inspiration behind the album and the recording process.
Listen to the full interview above, and read a transcript below.
Interview Transcript
Diane: Hey Dave and Ryan. Hey, welcome back. We haven't been gone from each other for too long. It's good to see you guys back in the studio.
Dave Pirner: Maybe I should be interviewing you, because when I first met you, I didn't know you played guitar and sang.
Diane: Well, yeah, I guess I don't always tell people, you know, but I'm glad you found out.
Dave Pirner: I don't tell people I play...
Ryan Smith: I don't tell anyone I play. You were awesome at the Tommy Stinson show.
Diane: Wow! Thank you. That was such an honor, of course, to play on that night and to open for you all at First Avenue.
Dave Pirner: I've played with Tommy. It's not really an honor (laughs). I'm kidding! I gotta give them a hard time. Part of the code.
Diane: Well, anyways, we're here for a very special reason. Y'all are releasing your 13th studio album, Slowly But Shirley. Y'all played a couple of songs today and then played a throwback. Tell me about this new record produced by Steve Jordan.
Dave Pirner: Well, I mean, we had been making records here -- not here, in Minneapolis, not East Berlin. Sorry, that's not my line. Sid Hartman. You know who Sid Hartman is.
Diane: No, I don't.
Dave Pirner: Some old radio personality. Anyhow, so I decided that I was kind of -- the way we had been making records for a couple records, it was really intuitive and really -- "Oh, like, every song was different in a way that sometimes would be like, okay, Dave, play the song to a click with an acoustic guitar. And then Michael will add the drums, and then, like, really kind of high concept stuff. And then, you know, people have home studios, and it's like, okay. So it all kind of gets -- Steve is all about get the band in a room and play the song, and that's what you're going to hear. And that's the way he did it in 1990 when I worked with him. And when I worked with him in 1990 I met Niko Bolas, who's Neil Young's recording engineer and producer and whatnot. I called him up and I said, "Hey, man, I want to make a record. And I remember hanging out with you." And we made the record with Steve in 1990, and we sent him a song, and he mixed it, and he sent it back. And then I got a phone call from a manager, I believe, and he said, "Guess who wants to produce your record?" And I'm like, I have no idea. And he goes, "Steve Jordan." And I called Michael Bland right away. And I was like, guess who wants to produce our new record. That's very exciting because working with Steve is a joy. And it's very player oriented. It's very much about getting the performance out of the band all at the same time in the same room. And honestly, I don't think people do that very much anymore, but whatever. So we did. We cut the record at Terrarium, here in Minneapolis, Northeast Minneapolis. And then I went to New York, and did the vocals and the mix at Electric Lady, and it was done. So it was really almost spontaneous feeling. A lot of the songs, we were kind of playing for, not the first time, but -- so, Steve likes to capture that thing that, you know, beat the song to death by playing it 30 times. You try to kind of get the initial excitement. And it went great. It was a relatively painless record for me, that's how I say it. I've been known to have some, you know, traumatic experiences trying to make records. But it really just wasn't there. It all felt great. And hopefully that translates to the record.
Diane: Absolutely. Thinking about Steve Jordan now that he's a drummer for one of the best, greatest rock bands that the planet has ever seen. And when you worked with him -- it's been over 30 years? Gosh, I'm like comprehending time, and I'm just like, holy man. I feel like there's probably these distinctive qualities about Steve Jordan that were available then and are available now. And you mentioned (the record) And The horse They Rode On, y'all capturing the magic of being a band, and still 30 years later, he's that same, tried and true producer.
Dave Pirner: Yes.
Diane: What else would you convey about his --
Dave Pirner: Watching him and Michael Bland work together was worth what -- I was paid in full. I was like, "This is great." And I believe, as someone who fronts a band, that you really are only as good as your drummer. So there's a handful of people -- like, Sterling Campbell was with the band for a while, Michael Bland, of course. And then there's these people like Charlie Drayton and Steve Jordan and Jerry Pentecost, who's playing with us now, and they are the greatest drummers in the world. I mean, I totally believe that. They're sought after because they're the greatest drummers in the world. Except, once I started playing with these people, I got a little spoiled. And then you have this pocket, and someone can bring that pocket to you, and it all falls into the pocket, and you're like, it's like a relief. So yeah, I mean, Steve is great. It didn't surprise me, but me and Sterling and Michael and all these people that are fans of Steve were thrilled when we heard he got the gig with The Rolling Stones. We were just like, That's so awesome.
Diane: That's incredible. And speaking of drummers, y'all were drummerless today. And one thing I was just like, rocking out and hearing y'all play the iconic song of yours, Black Gold, and then into these new songs, is just like, “Oh, wow!” The way that y'all are able to keep time, even with just batting the guitar in between bars in "High Road", and then the way that you have to magically play these intricate guitar lines and keep phenomenal time. What is that like? I feel like there's this incredible, magical chemistry that you two (have) when you play together. Of course, it's the possession of talent. But I'm just curious about how you find each other.
Dave Pirner: I might say that as a duo, I kept challenging Ryan to do more stuff. So when you listen to these recordings that we just did here moments ago, he's playing the tambourine with his foot, which you can't really tell from listening to it. But I always have to mention that it's not coming from anywhere. He's playing the tambourine with his foot, and he took it on like a champ. And then we kind of -- well, you talk about the sponge tambourine, or should we not even talk about it?
Ryan Smith: Well, we can talk about it. It's a creation, I think, inspired by K.T. Tunstall, I believe. Someone we work with also works with her, Janine, and she created it. I think, invented it, basically from seeing what she was doing ...you step on it and the sponge comes back. There was a Frisbee involved. It's patented. We can't say exactly how.
Dave Pirner: We have fun playing as a duo. But actually it's way more fun playing playing with a rhythm section and really loud and electric guitars and stuff. Which is cool because this new record is -- I played less acoustic guitar than I played on a record since Grave Dancers Union. And that was really cool to me, because just -- Steve's like, "We're gonna cut it live and you're gonna play electric guitar, and that's that." And I was like, "Great!"
Diane: Yes, it's very rock and roll. It captures the essence of Soul Asylum's music. But while y'all continue to expand and expand. And I know you've talked about with every record, you learn new things and techniques, and it becomes easier. And you mentioned how this record was relatively painless (to produce) compared to other records. But yeah, tell me some of the characteristics you feel of this newer sound of this record that you feel like are really new to --
Dave Pirner: The comparison is -- in 1990, when we worked with Steve, we were still kind of a punk rock band that needed honing. And he made us play songs over and over again and over and over and over. And he taught us how to play together as a band more so than we had -- and we'd been together for 15, 10, I don't know how many years. But this record was different because I had Michael bland playing drums, and it went really smoothly. What would you say about the characteristics of this record, Ryan.
Ryan Smith: I think it's more raw, and it's really adventurous. To me it's exciting and fun to play. Every song on the record translates live. And I feel like that's because of pre-production. We ended up playing for Steve, the album, like a concert over Zoom.
Dave Pirner: Which is the first time I've ever done that.
Diane: Whoa, technology. So, over Zoom. Explain to me how that works.
Dave Pirner: I was like, "What are you talking about?" Because I'm kind of Luddite or something. He's like, "Yeah, we'll just put me on a screen in the practice space, and you guys will play the song, and I'll listen, and I'll go, 'Eh, I don't like that. Change it.'"
Diane: Wow.
Dave Pirner: Okay, how about this? And he's like, better, but --
Diane: So he did this without being in Minneapolis?
Dave Pirner: The pre-production. In the practice space. And pre-production, as Ryan was saying, is, I think, a really essential element of recording a band. I mean, you don't really do pre-production if you're Thomas Dolby. I don't know why I came up with his name, but you're doing everything on a computer, or whatever the case may be.
Diane: You were a big fan of drag racing growing up, and I'm curious to hear about Shirley ChaCha Muldowney, who was a pioneer for women in the sport that women just didn't completely belong in. And she's the cover image and model and part of inspiration of this new record. Tell me more of where you draw a connection.
Dave Pirner: Yeah, I used to collect dragster cars when I was a real little kid, like baseball cards. They were just dragster cars. Pictures of dragsters. And I don't know. I've always liked car design. For some reason I don't really like driving. And I drive a really sh***y car. But I do like to go fast, which is why I don't like driving, because I can't drive 55 -- who said that?
Ryan Smith: Sammy Hagar.
Diane: So you can't drive 55 in the neighborhoods of Minneapolis.
Dave Pirner: Yeah, so here she came, you know, and started beating all these people. And I just was like -- to imagine what she was up against, being the first woman to walk into a bunch of greasy dudes going, "Chicks can't drive" or whatever it is. And yeah, she was one of those people that -- you remember the war the sexes? It was like Bobby Riggs and Billie Jean King. And there was this early kind of movement of women coming to the forefront. And she was right on, you know, right there. And she's always been a huge hero to me. And I got the idea, you know, Slowly But Shirley, and we called her up, and she was excited about it. She's still alive. She gave us her blessing, and that made the whole thing feel even better. Because sometimes people will go, "No, you can't use my image for your record cover" or whatever the case may be. And always been a fan. And she's still involved with racing a lot. She doesn't drive anymore. But they had 20 replicas of her funny car, and they're for sale right now. We had a picture of her in front of a funny car that we were going to use, and she said, "No. Let me send you a picture of" -- she wants to be known for the dragster. And that's what -- the dragster is the craziest, weirdest looking vehicle to me, especially when I was a kid. I was like, man, it's like a rocket with huge back wheels and funny front wheels. And she got in a terrible crash. She came right back. And, you know, hopefully I'll get to meet her.
Diane: I feel like there's a parallel, too, with people who like high-speed chasing, also with heavy, loud rock and roll. It's such an adrenaline thing.
Dave Pirner: And it's loud. It's very loud.
Diane: And it's loud! So you were a little kid, and were going out to drag races, and seeing this and being in awe.
Dave Pirner: Nah. I didn't go to any drag races when I was a kid. It just wasn't in the cards for me. So I suppose I fantasized about it and watched it on TV. But as far as I know, Brainerd is where you go to race?...But what I really want to do is take my Toyota Camry out there. And see how fast it'll go. It's in my, it's on my list of bucket list.
Diane: (Laughs) Yeah, I noticed you have a vote shirt on. Would you like to make any proclamations of your political stance?
Dave Pirner: Yeah, I would. I got Kamala fever. I got the fever. I couldn’t be more excited about Kamala Harris, and I think that she is amazing. And the first time around, when it was Trump and Biden, I started just, you know, people say vote, which is good. It's good. Everyone should vote. But then I started going, “Why am I saying vote when I know when I'm really what I'm really trying to say, which was vote for Joe Biden” And I was doing an interview with some people, but what is that called? the Brady Bunch thing? And I'm like, Yeah, vote for Joe Biden. What's, what's the worst thing that could happen? You could die, and then Kamala Harris would be president. So here she is, and I offered my services to play fundraisers. I've been to a fundraiser already, and then you throw Tim Walz in there, and then that kind of adds even more, yeah, this is, this is for me, kind of --
Diane: Minnesota pride.
Dave Pirner: Yeah, you know. And just, she seems really great. I think her background is amazing, and I think she's super smart, and I hope she wins.