Minnesota Mean is a new documentary that takes viewers into the exciting world of roller derby — spotlighting the athleticism and commitment of the players. But something even deeper rises to the surface: The deep bond the roller derby athletes share with one another. As one of the athletes puts it, “These women are my family.”

Dawn Mikkelson is the director, producer and editor of Minnesota Mean. Mikkelson joins Jill Riley on The Current’s Morning show to talk about the film. And Jill Riley, as a retired roller derby athlete, lends additional insight describing what she took away from watching the film. Listen to the complete interview using the audio player above, and read a transcript below.

Interview Transcript

Jill Riley: The Current, music from Plantlife with "Rollerskate Jam," and we'll certainly be talking about perhaps some jams of skating and the actual roller derby jam. If you don't know the jam, we'll tell you about the jam. And before that you heard, well, a country classic, Roger Miller, "You Can't Roller Skate in a Buffalo Herd." But guess what? I'm here to say that you can. Because I have the experience with it as a retired roller derby player. It was a lot of fun to watch a recent, recently released documentary called Minnesota Mean, as a retired player, I was feeling the nostalgia. I even, believe it or not — well, I'm an emotional person — but I teared up a couple of times watching this new documentary, which takes viewers into this thrilling world of roller derby, which is still going strong in Minnesota. The documentary follows the lives of six incredibly badass women, as they chase after the ultimate prize, the Hydra — we'll talk more about that as well, because that's a big part of the story — and when the team's top player gets well sidelined with an injury, which has happened to the best of them, well, the question looms large: Can they still clinch the victory? And you know what? This is not a typical sports tale, sports story. It really is a raw look into the lives of tough, independent women; the camaraderie; the confidence building; and just the grit and determination that shows what it takes to play the sport; and the teamwork. And it's a lot of fun to watch. Produced and directed by Dawn Mikkelson, it is called Minnesota Mean. And Dawn Mikkelson is in the studio with me this morning on The Current's Morning Show. Hi, Dawn.

Dawn Mikkelson: Hello.

Jill Riley: Very good to meet you.

Dawn Mikkelson: You too.

Jill Riley: Well, first question here: What made you want to document roller derby here in Minnesota?

Dawn Mikkelson: Well, my friend, actually, Lisa Math, started skating when she was just about 40. And she discovered this sport in my world, and oh, my god, fell in love with it, fell in love with the sport that she was such a big part of. I also thought she was a little nuts. It was like, "You are going to hurt yourself." And she did. But the community was worth it. And seeing that community of powerful women being powerful, but also so supportive of each other, I was like, "This is a world I would love to hang out in." And the only way I can hang out in worlds that I'm not a part of is filming. So here we are.

Jill Riley: Yeah. So Dawn, tell me about the team that you profiled in the documentary, because when I saw Minnesota Mean, I was like, "Ooh, yeah, yep. Minnesota roller derby is mean!" And I went, "Well, wait a minute..." See, I knew them as the Minnesota All Stars, but they had a nickname that I wasn't familiar with, because Dawn, I'm a retired roller girl, and I'm a little far removed from the world, and I know that the game has changed a lot, but it's still going strong, like 20 years strong in Minnesota. So tell me about Minnesota Mean.

Dawn Mikkelson: The title?

Jill Riley: Yeah, the title, the team, and where that came from?

Dawn Mikkelson: Well, so the Minnesota Mean, was a takeoff of, of course, "Minnesota Nice," which actually the B team, traveling team skated under Minnesota Nice for a very long time. And so at some point, they needed a title. And they were like, well, I mean, we're known for being tough. And it just kind of happened. It's not clear to me if they still skate under Minnesota Mean now.

Jill Riley: I hope so!

Dawn Mikkelson: I would love it if they did. They go by both titles, I would say: All Stars and Minnesota Mean.

Jill Riley: OK, so, Minnesota Mean, the documentary, now can you give me kind of like the time in which the documentary was made? Because it wasn't just made last year.

Dawn Mikkelson: No.

Jill Riley: Like, what season, what time were you profiling, were you documenting?

Dawn Mikkelson: So it was the season of 2017. And it was a season where a lot of the players had been playing for close to a decade with each other. And a number of them were considering retirement seriously. And, you know, this is a conversation that happens a lot in derby, like, "I want to retire," and then they don't.

Jill Riley: Yeah, "I think this is the last year. Well..."

Dawn Mikkelson: Exactly.

Jill Riley: Yeah.

Dawn Mikkelson: But for many of them this was, and so it's really a special season because they wanted to go out big. And you know, what better way to do that but have it documented forever in a film? So yeah, it was 2017, and then of course the nature of independent film is that these things take a long time. So here we are in 2024, and it is being released.

Jill Riley: Sure. Dawn Mikkelson is here on The Current's Morning Show, producer, director and editor of Minnesota Mean, featuring Minnesota roller derby, Minnesota Roller Girls, and just incredible athletes. Dawn, it was a lot of fun to watch this documentary. As you know, in the time period that I played, roller derby still was a lot of sports entertainment. But things were starting to shift in this direction of — because there were so many really true athletes joining, I mean, former rugby players and hockey players, and you name it, people that were really hungry for a contact sport. And so I really appreciate how you document the lives of skaters, but also, you're really documenting what it takes to play the game. I mean, really, that was my takeaway. And it was cool to see how the sport has shifted. What was kind of your take away from really getting an inside look of what it takes to be that kind of athlete?

Dawn Mikkelson: You know, I think that it's a it's a combination of things. Certainly, I mean, these athletes are practicing multiple times a week, they're working out every day, they have a commitment to the sport that does not pay them any money and, you know, frankly, creates injuries and costs them money; you know, all that gear is not cheap, unless you are sponsored. So really, this commitment is huge. And that is inspiring to me as a person who does not consider herself an athlete by nature. I am now an athlete, maybe by proxy, I'm not sure. But no, I mean, the level of athleticism, and that was something I talked about with the team early on, was that they were concerned that often derby stories are about the fun names, and playfulness, and they have all of that, but that the athleticism was being lost. And so that was a commitment that I made to them as I was like, "I want people to see how powerful you are physically."

Jill Riley: Totally. I'm here with Dawn Mikkelson, the producer and director of the new documentary, Minnesota Mean, it's all about Roller Derby, the game and the lives of the players and the athleticism of the players. Dawn, let's talk some more in just a minute. I want to give people a little taste of what the film is all about. So we're going to play a little clip here from Minnesota Mean, on The Current:

Jill Riley: You know, I always love the announcers for Minnesota Roller Girls and now Minnesota Roller Derby, by the way, which they still play at the legendary Roy Wilkins Auditorium, just up the street here in downtown St. Paul. You know, listening to that clip right there — by the way, I'm with Dawn Mikkelson, the director and producer of Minnesota Mean — just listening to that clip, I recognized a couple of the voices: Shiver Me Kimbers, I remember her. I think it was either her rookie season or perhaps her second season when I was finishing up my time with Minnesota Roller Girls. And I didn't know much about her. And what I really took away from the profile, really this kind of not only a profile of the team, but really kind of honing in on six of the players specifically, is it wasn't just about teamwork on the track and then going home. This was really a supportive community.  Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. And, you know, back to my friend Lisa Math, I mean, when she had her injury, the people driving her to doctor's appointments and bringing her food, I mean, I was like, it's kind of like what I feel like church should have been back in the day when I would go to church; you know, it was this community that was there for you regardless. And I think as women in particular, you know, culture has not necessarily encouraged us to be a team. You know, we've been encouraged to be individuals and to see each other as competition.  Exactly.

Dawn Mikkelson: And this this, I mean, of course, it's competition. It's a sport.

Jill Riley: Yeah.

Dawn Mikkelson: But at the end of the day, that's not what it's about for these players.

Jill Riley: Yeah. And I experienced, I would watch competition on people's own team, on their own home team. But I think a lot of that fizzled away as folks got to know each other. But there really was, and what you're talking about that community, and like the true idea of what fellowship is all about and support, and by the way, Dawn, I was just talking with some of my colleagues about it was my first season of derby, and just watching this documentary, I was thinking back because I related so much to what happens in people's personal lives when something major happens, and you have people rally around you. It was my first season with the home team that I played on, I experienced the loss of my mother, and it was what? A month or two months later, two months later that I got married. And it was it was all of this, like, big stuff happening at the same time. And my entire team showed up for that wedding. And they wore their uniforms and served cake on rollerskates. I understand that the priest at the church in my hometown for a number of years had a picture of it was him with the entire derby team. But it was just like this instant family. And that part is so special. And I wonder is that really unique to the world of roller derby? To have that bond? And so quickly?

Dawn Mikkelson: Right. That's a good question. I mean, in some ways, you would probably be a better person to answer that than me.

Jill Riley: I guess from your observation, I guess.

Dawn Mikkelson: You know, I think that there's something to be said about it being considered still an "outsider" sport, and sport, and I throw that in air quotes. But you know, it is such a unique community, and, you know, they're bonding over a lot of things, including the misconception of what they do and who they are. And so I think that any outsider community, that brings you together. I know that I, as a queer person, I definitely related to that, that feeling of family outside of family, outside of your family of origin, that there was the family of choice. And that's what it feels like. So yeah, I hope there's more spaces like that for women and for anybody who's feeling marginalized. It's so powerful. And actually, Lisa, — well, Diamond Rough — and I had talked for a bit about this idea of non-derby world and how you had to change yourself and change your language when you went back into the non-derby world. Because it was like you were so comfortable just being who you are, and then you had to, like, temper yourself going back into the regular world.

Jill Riley: Sure. Yeah. Ooh, that's a relatable one as well. I brought up the name Shiver Me Kimbers, and just of what we were talking about there, having that camaraderie and that family and that tight bond. I just want to play a clip from Minnesota Mean, where Shiver Me Kimbers is talking about her teammates. So let's take a listen.

If you would have told me 10 years ago that I'm going to have more female friends than male friends, I would have just laughed and said, "You're full of sh--," because they were competition, because they were judging me, because I wasn't good enough, or because I was way better. ... For a lot of people playing roller derby helps stop some of that. ... These women are my family. – Shiver Me Kimbers

Jill Riley: Yep, I think she sums it up right there with that experience. So the documentary Minnesota Mean, it is streaming now. You can find it in a couple different spots. Where can people stream this?

Dawn Mikkelson: Definitely on Apple TV and Amazon. If you don't have those services, you can go to our website, minnesotameanfilm.com. And we've got links to a bunch of other places you can find it.

Jill Riley: Yeah. What's been the response? I mean, in the derby community, in the greater community, what's been the response to the film?

Dawn Mikkelson: You know, it's been fun, particularly in the derby community, because again, I don't feel like there's been representation of that community that is accurate. And so when I've gone to festivals around the country, you know, players are like, "Oh my god, that's my life. That's us." You know, and seeing yourself reflected if you're in any kind of community that is underrepresented, it's so empowering and affirming, I think. But I will also say that it's been fun watching people connect with different characters within the film. So some people are like, "Oh my god, I'm totally Shiver Me Kimbers," or "Oh my god, I'm totally Brickyard." You know, we bring who we are to the cinema, right? And so those characters, depending on what your life experience is, will connect with you in different ways. And so, you know, in some ways, I felt more like a Brickyard than anything. But I know people who are like "I am Smoka Hontas, hands down." 

Jill Riley: Exactly. And, you know, and you don't have to be a current player or a retired player to relate, you know, like Dawn, you're saying, to relate to the personalities or the experiences, certainly the experiences of the women featured in this film. So it is called Minnesota Mean. So Dawn, tryouts next season, what time are we meeting?

Dawn Mikkelson: Yeah, no, that's a good question.

Jill Riley: Did you think about it? You know, when you were making the film?

Dawn Mikkelson: Not a second. 

Jill Riley: Really! You weren't inspired to put on skates and join up?

Dawn Mikkelson: I was inspired to encourage my daughter to join derby. So she's 11, and she plays with the Minnesota Frostbite.

Jill Riley: OK, and is that the Junior League?

Dawn Mikkelson: That's Junior League, yep. And so they they play year round, but primarily fall through spring. And so I'm still a part of derby now, as a mom.

Jill Riley: OK. Have you watched kind of a shift in confidence in your own kid playing?

Dawn Mikkelson: Absolutely.

Jill Riley: Yeah.

Dawn Mikkelson: Particularly confidence around what her body is capable of, and how she carries herself, just on an everyday basis. I mean, you know, this sport is about taking up space and not being apologetic about that. And, you know, again, culturally, if you're told to always be small and say, "Sorry!" and "Oops!" all the time, particularly in Minnesota, but Minnesota women, yeah, this is that opportunity to be like, "No, this is the space I'm taking up. You can go around me."

Jill Riley: Yeah, I was an inside blocker, and, well, my greatest asset on the track was one of the first three letters of the word that I just said. And I couldn't have been more confident and proud of it.

Dawn Mikkelson: Right.

Jill Riley: And encouraged to really, you know, stick it out, and block the jammers from getting through. Well, Dawn, it's been a lot of fun to talk about this. I mean, for me, personally, just a really cool trip down a road of a life that I used to have, but also a road that is still very active for plenty of skaters at Roy Wilkins.

Dawn Mikkelson: Absolutely. And seriously, we are so lucky in Minnesota to have that venue. You know, having toured around the country with that team, there is nothing like the Roy Wilkins Arena. You know, it's like a rock show, you get beer, they shoot a cannon and then you get a T-shirt. I mean, you know!

Jill Riley: Yep! I love to hear that that's still going on, that the T-shirt cannon is still alive and well. Dawn Mikkelson, producer and director of Minnesota Mean, which you can find on Apple TV, you can find it at the website. Can you repeat those two things once again, the website and you said one more.

Dawn Mikkelson: And Amazon!

Jill Riley: Yep, and Amazon, thank you very much! Come on, it's Prime Day, I should have Amazon at the top of my head. So Minnesota Mean, thank you so much for coming in. And, you know, Dawn, I want to go out with the music of Dessa here, because the music of Dessa is featured quite prominently in the film. So can you talk just a little bit about why Dessa's music? And what was the process? Do you just call somebody up and say, "Yeah, can I talk to Dessa because we think her music is inspiring"? What was it about Dessa’s music?

Dawn Mikkelson: Well, I've been listening to Dessa personally, during the filming of this movie, and during the edit, and the combination of her power, as well as her vulnerability, I mean, like her lyrics can be quite vulnerable, and it reflected this world so easily. And so I reached out to Doomtree, who I'd actually collaborated with on a previous film, Risking Light; Cecil Otter had some music in that film. And so, you know, they were a known entity to me, and vice versa. And so I reached out and I was like, "What can we do to make this happen? Is this even possible?" And, you know, working as independent filmmaker and independent musician, we get each other on a certain level. So we made it happen, and I'm so happy to have Dessa in this film.

Jill Riley: Yeah, I think it just really brought some of the scenes to life. And yeah, the music and the subject matter I think complemented each other so well. Dawn, thank you so much. Dawn Mikkelson, again, thank you for your work on the documentary and thanks for being a fan of roller derby. I love it.

Dawn Mikkelson: Thanks for having me, and I'm so glad you played!

Jill Riley: Yes. All right, I have, maybe, what do I call it? A permanent limp. But you know what? The three years that I was active and played were some the best of my life, so I wouldn't go back and change it for anything. This song is used I think to great effect and it has that really spirit of that empowerment. It's "5 out of 6" from Dessa, and it's on The Current.

External Links

Minnesota Mean – official website

Minnesota Roller Derby – official website